Stevesei - ECU's Looms etc



  • Guys, I know this is an old thread, but isn't it possible to simply move the K8 sensors to the ZE engine without replacing the wiring? The engine doesn't care and that seems a lot easier. I have a 92 mx-3 and swapped in my OBDII Millenia engine exactly that way. It works fine. You mention UK wiring, but if you swap the sensors, why would that matter? Just asking!



  • An engine is neither OBD1 or OBD2.

    It is the engine loom/ECU that is either OBD1 or OBD2.

    In the UK we have the OBD1 loom from 1991 to 1993/94 then we got what I call the OBD1.5 loom from 1994 to end of production.

    In the USA they got the OBD1 loom from 1991 to 1994/94 and the OBD2 loom 1994 to end of production.

    To do a proper KLZE swap using a proper KLZE ECU you need to use an OBD1 loom as there were no OBD1.5 or OBD2 KLZE ECU's made.

    Or you can use a Probinator chip on a K8 ECU.

    –----

    What you did Stevesei is use an OBD1 loom, the engine did not matter and the only sensor you needed to swap were the VAF and the DIZZY the rest are interchangeable as far as I can remember.
    The problems only arise when you have an OBD1.5 loom as you cannot get an ECU for it and if you try the USA OBD2 way and use Adjustable FPR and KL02 VAF its still not a great running car and there is no OBD2 connector to hook it up to a PC like they do over there. It runs that bad compared to a proper OBD1 swap that I wouldn't bother.

    –-----

    If your reading this and have the 'OBD1.5' loom and really wanted to do the swap I would swap in an OBD1 loom personally.


    Hope that clears it up.



  • Thanks for the reply, it makes sense to change wiring if you just can't get an OBD1.5 ECU for a ZE, since you really need to change ECUs to make any 2.5 work correctly. My point was that you just swap all of the existing K8 sensors onto the DE, ZE or what-have-you and use the existing wiring. Since an ECU is required anyway, get a Probe or MX-6 ECU and have it chipped.

    I think Probinator is out of business, but stoker100 can almost surely read your original chip to flash a new one to the OBD1.5 standard. He did a custom one for my Millenia motor and it works very nicely. He is at stoker100@hotmail.com, and is in Australia. He MIGHT need to have an OBD1.5 ECU to copy, so it might take a bit of time to send stuff back and forth. A little planning instead of endless hours of swapping wiring would most likely be a good trade-off.

    I have made an inquiry to Steven, (stoker100) to see if this is a possibility.



  • Does the uk OBD2 probe/mx-6 ecu work on the uk mx-3 obd2 loom?

    If so then I guess you could chip it for the ZE, but you would need to change the VAF to the probe/mx-6 one.

    But I'm not sure if its possible to chip the OBD2 Probe/MX-6 ECU.

    I'm pretty sure its not.



  • Stoker100 says he doesn't know about OBD1.5. He would like for someone to open up one of the ECUs and send him pictures to determine if it can be chipped. He says he would need an ECU in hand to read the mapping, then apply new mapping. It all sounds doable if someone there would spend a little time with it.

    Also, I'm fairly certain that different harnesses (looms) would plug into existing VAF connectors, but yes, you would probably need to change to another VAF if you went to the OBDI loom, as you would with most any 2.5L conversion. I use an MX-6 VAF on mine.

    Also, in reply to an earlier post, I swapped my K8 distributor onto the 2.5, then modded it to use the external HEI module and coil. I also replaced the OBDII temp sensors with the ones from the K8.



  • @8a9bc8836b:

    But I'm not sure if its possible to chip the OBD2 Probe/MX-6 ECU.

    I'm pretty sure its not.

    Just checked and I was correct you can't chip an OBD2 MX-6 / probe ECU.

    @8a9bc8836b:

    Also, I'm fairly certain that different harnesses (looms) would plug into existing VAF connectors

    Yes they do, but you should use the VAF that matches the ECU chip code.

    @8a9bc8836b:

    but yes, you would probably need to change to another VAF if you went to the OBDI loom, as you would with most any 2.5L conversion. I use an MX-6 VAF on mine.

    You should use the JE50 VAF if you are using the KLZE ECU or a chipped K8 ECU.

    –-

    What I meant was:

    If you were going to get the Probe/MX-6 ECU chipped, with an off the shelf chip then they usually did away with needing a JE50 VAF in favour of the KL02. So you would need one of those.

    But this only applies to OBD1, I'm confused about what you want to do?


    @8a9bc8836b:

    He says he would need an ECU in hand to read the mapping, then apply new mapping.

    Thought you were talking about using an OBD2 PROBE/MX-6 ECU, so wouldn't he need one of those? But you can't chip these…


    @8a9bc8836b:

    Stoker100 says he doesn't know about OBD1.5. He would like for someone to open up one of the ECUs and send him pictures to determine if it can be chipped.

    Probinators guy who was doing chips said that he could not do chips for the OBD2 MX-3 ECU and that only certain OBD1 ECU's with a certain chip number could be chipped. So you can't use an MX-3 ECU.

    The UK version of OBD2 'OBD1.5' ECU is more similar to the OBD2 ECU than the OBD1. Its somewhere in between the 2, so I'm not sure if it can be chipped but I would guess not.

    @8a9bc8836b:

    Since an ECU is required anyway, get a Probe or MX-6 ECU and have it chipped.

    You can only chip a OBD1 MX-6/Probe ECU. And you can already buy chips for them…


    There are already chips out there for the MX-6 ecu that you can buy, just ask on MX-6.com. So you don't need to get one made, just buy one...


    @8a9bc8836b:

    I think Probinator is out of business

    I'm not sure, but I bought one of his chips for my first ZE swap and when I did the second swap I just took it to custom a circuit board design and manufacturing company who copied it and installed it for me while I waited.

    So I'm sure we could get some made if we needed one, there are a couple of guys on here with probinator chips we could get copied.

    –-

    @8a9bc8836b:

    I also replaced the OBDII temp sensors with the ones from the K8.

    You don't need to do this they are the same in the UK.



  • I'm not sure what you are trying to do? So let me clarify for everyone so we can stop going over old ground with the ZE swap

    1.) You can already get chips for a K8 ECU on OBD1 loom, so forget about that.

    2.) You can already get chips for DE ECU on OBD1 loom, so forget about that too.

    3.) You cannot chip a K8 OBD2 ECU, so forget about that.

    4.) You can't chip a DE OBD2 ECU, So forget about that.

    5.) You can put a ZE into an 'UK version OBD-2' MX-3 and swap a few bits from the K8 to get it running. But it does not run anywhere near as good as an OBD-1 ZE swap, so I would not bother. So lets forget about that too.

    6.) You can put a ZE into an 'UK version OBD-2' MX-3 and swap a few bits from the K8 to get it running. And use a KL02 VAF to smooth out fuelling a bit. But it still does not run anywhere near as good as an OBD-1 ZE swap, so I would not bother. So lets forget about that too.

    7.) You can put a ZE into an 'UK version OBD-2' MX-3 and swap a few bits from the K8 to get it running. And use a KL02 VAF to smooth out fuelling a bit. And add an adjustable FPR so you can fine tune the fuelling. But it still does not run anywhere near as good as an OBD-1 ZE swap and costs more, so I would not bother. So lets forget about that too.

    8.) You can use megasquirt on either OBD1 or OBD1.5 or OBD2 looms.

    The only thing we do not know is if the 'OBD1.5' ECU we have in the UK can be chipped. But it seems to share more with the ODB2 than the OBD1, so I would guess that it can not be chipped. But nobody knows for sure.

    Is that what you are talking about? Getting hold of one of our OBD1.5 ECU's and sending it to Stoker100 to see if it can be chipped?



  • CRYSTAL!!! Admin, that needs to be posted on UK-MX3 home page?? headed as " KL ZE SWAP???…..DONT BOTHER UNLESS YOU HAVE......... !! " Deffo when the debate/question about OBD1.5 has been resolved?? :bigok:

    Brilliant clarification :respect:


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